Low Neck Angle-Stanford and other imports......

RSS
Email

0 Kudo

Author	Comment
intune66	Low Neck Angle-Stanford and other imports......	Lead	[-]
Posts: 2261 (05/18/09 09:45 AM) Moderator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Tags : None Anyone checked the neck angle on your Stanford, Blueridge or other import guitar? Of my 3 Stanfords only 1 passes this Test ....... I've also checked this on my Blueridges and found that they are borderline as well. In a thread on another forum someone who just bought a PSD-21 (used) reported seeing it on his and said it's common among the Yamaha guitars and a lot of the imports. Any opinions? Is this just the way they build them in Asia? I'd be interested in knowing if the neck angles are low in the Furch (Czech-made) Stanfords. At this point I dont see a big problem although it seems like I cant go low enough on the action with my PSD-21 before I start to get some fret buzz. I think the problem is more in the nut on mine needing some work or maybe I need a new nut altogether. No need to be alarmed. I'm just pointing this out as it seems to be a little common and I'm wondering why. Anyone checked this on American made instruments? Do they generally pass the neck angle test? Does it matter much, as long as you can get the guitar to setup the way you want it? Ryan _____________________ Some of my Guitars: Stanford PSD-28, 21, 20 Blueridge BR-70, 60-AS Aria AD-80, R.K. RDC-57 Last Edited By: intune66 05/18/09 09:54 AM. Edited 1 time.
Pappy		#1	[-]
Posts: 597 (05/18/09 11:07 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I saw this several months back and did the straight edge check on both my BR163 and the Eastman 508S. Both passed the test. But really, even if there is a low neck, does it mean all that much? Firstly, the rate at which it is going to increase cannot be prejudged by the initial position. A "good test" guitar may, in some period of time, exceed the angle change of the original "bad test." Secondly, as long as there is still saddle to play with you can just keep lowering it until you're out of space. Even beyond that you can shave the bridge if so inclined to gain a few more years. Thirdly, when the point of no return is reached and a neck reset is the only alternative in (20-25 years ???) you can decide whether spending $250 - $350 (in 2009 dollars) is a worthwhile investment on the guitar. For a guitar in the $800 range that could be as high as 44% of the original cost. In that case the replacement cost of a new guitar would look attractive, as it would with any other tool that wore out over 20-25 years. If the original cost was very high, and the guitar held it's value well, then a reset makes more economic sense. Fourthly, and most important, when you're 65 you don't worry too much about your guitar 25 years down the road! So many guitars....So little time. So many taxes......So few guitars
dmcowles		#2	[-]
Posts: 2824 (05/18/09 12:26 PM) Admin Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	What Pappy said. I haven't examined the neck angle on my PSD 28, and probably won't. From our perspective, having a guitar that may cause worries 20 years down the line is a non-issue. Playing a guitar on a Hoveround or wheelchair, or while shuffling along on a walker just doesn't seem feasible. You forget it and I'll forget it, but I'll remember it, and don't you forget it!
Bob Bell.acousticfingers...		#3	[-]
Posts: 4 (05/18/09 12:32 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	The first PSRD-28 I received had a neck angle that looked just like the 2nd straight edge picture shown in your link. The straight edge laid down the neck hit about 1/4 inch below the top of the bridge and there was very little saddle to work with if the action needed to be lowered (and it did). It played fine, but I knew over time it could turn into an issue. I took it to a guitar tech for a 2nd opinion, and he said if it was his, he'd send it back. I discussed the issue with Steve. He said no problem, send it back. The replacement PSRD-28 came in perfect. The straight edge down the neck lays right on top of the bridge, and there is plenty of saddle to work with. I couldn't be happier! My Larrivee OM has been relegated to second class citizen and I share my favorite chair with the PSRD.
intune66		#4	[-]
Posts: 2263 (05/18/09 02:30 PM) Moderator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	dmcowles wrote: What Pappy said. I haven't examined the neck angle on my PSD 28, and probably won't. From our perspective, having a guitar that may cause worries 20 years down the line is a non-issue. Playing a guitar on a Hoveround or wheelchair, or while shuffling along on a walker just doesn't seem feasible. Now that got me laughing just picturing it! Bob Bell...... Sounds like there is an inconsistency in the neck angles. The straight edge lands just above the bridge on my PSD-20 while it lands slightly below the bridge on my PSD-21 and 28. The 20 and 28 have awesome action and plenty of saddle with no buzzes. The 21 gets minimal buzzing if I try to lower it more than it is presently, but the nut needs some work and I think that will correct my problems. I agree with Pappy on his thoughts. For what I paid for these it just aint worth getting worked up about. I'd be hard pressed to get this kind of tone in the $450-$600 range and I love the necks and string spacing. I figured it out last nite- I couldn't buy a new D-18 for the price I paid for all 3 guitars. I'll deal with the problems with a smile if they ever arise...... Ryan _____________________ Some of my Guitars: Stanford PSD-28, 21, 20 Blueridge BR-70, 60-AS Aria AD-80, R.K. RDC-57
gypsyjazzguitars		#5	[-]
Posts: 388 (05/18/09 04:31 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Inconsistency in neck angle was my biggest complaint with the Performers. I discounted the ones with less than something - maybe it was 2 or 3 mm? saddle showing above the bridge. That was quite a few. Counting low angle necks and cosmetic problems over 20% of the shipments ended up not being what I considered firsts, and I likely missed details. Johnson assured me the QA is much better on current production. I haven't seen any issues like this with the Eastmans. Johnny Rushing custom OM, figured mahogany & ancient stained Sitka Loriente "Isabel" European Spruce, Pau Ferro Kawai KG4D grand piano and many other things fiddlefixins on yahoo messenger - drop by & say hi my shop
rlouie.theunofficialma...		#6	[-]
Posts: 169 (05/18/09 05:51 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	intune66 wrote: Anyone checked the neck angle on your Stanford, Blueridge or other import guitar? Of my 3 Stanfords only 1 passes this Test ....... I've also checked this on my Blueridges and found that they are borderline as well. In a thread on another forum someone who just bought a PSD-21 (used) reported seeing it on his and said it's common among the Yamaha guitars and a lot of the imports. Any opinions? Is this just the way they build them in Asia? I'd be interested in knowing if the neck angles are low in the Furch (Czech-made) Stanfords. At this point I dont see a big problem although it seems like I cant go low enough on the action with my PSD-21 before I start to get some fret buzz. I think the problem is more in the nut on mine needing some work or maybe I need a new nut altogether. No need to be alarmed. I'm just pointing this out as it seems to be a little common and I'm wondering why. Anyone checked this on American made instruments? Do they generally pass the neck angle test? Does it matter much, as long as you can get the guitar to setup the way you want it? Ryan, my Stanford/Furch DM5 passes the test but my PSD10 does not..........................
intune66		#7	[-]
Posts: 2265 (05/18/09 05:58 PM) Moderator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	rlouie wrote: Ryan, my Stanford/Furch DM5 passes the test but my PSD10 does not.......................... Thanks for the info, Louie....... As long as you get the action you want on the 10, it should be fine. What's happening with the PSD-20? Still got one on the way? Ryan _____________________ Some of my Guitars: Stanford PSD-28, 21, 20 Blueridge BR-70, 60-AS Aria AD-80, R.K. RDC-57
rlouie.theunofficialma...		#8	[-]
Posts: 170 (05/18/09 06:00 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	intune66 wrote: rlouie wrote: Ryan, my Stanford/Furch DM5 passes the test but my PSD10 does not.......................... Thanks for the info, Louie....... As long as you get the action you want on the 10, it should be fine. What's happening with the PSD-20? Still got one on the way? UPS tracking should read out for delivery tomorrow!!!!!!!!
rlouie.theunofficialma...		#9	[-]
Posts: 171 (05/18/09 06:28 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	my bet is that most of the performers series guitars will not pass the test.......................I'll be surprised if the PSD20 I am receiving tomorrow will pass the test........but rest assured yall will be the first to know..............but hell if I can get a good 10 years of playing out of her I've already won...........................
intune66		#10	[-]
Posts: 2268 (05/18/09 06:29 PM) Moderator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	rlouie wrote: intune66 wrote: rlouie wrote: Ryan, my Stanford/Furch DM5 passes the test but my PSD10 does not.......................... Thanks for the info, Louie....... As long as you get the action you want on the 10, it should be fine. What's happening with the PSD-20? Still got one on the way? UPS tracking should read out for delivery tomorrow!!!!!!!! Can you say............... SWEEEEEEEEEEET??? Hope it's every bit as good as the rest you own(ed). Ryan _____________________ Some of my Guitars: Stanford PSD-28, 21, 20 Blueridge BR-70, 60-AS Aria AD-80, R.K. RDC-57
rlouie.theunofficialma...		#11	[-]
Posts: 172 (05/18/09 06:59 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Can you say............... SWEEEEEEEEEEET??? Hope it's every bit as good as the rest you own(ed). me too Ryan, me too........
poboxnyc		#12	[-]
Posts: 38 (05/18/09 07:07 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Pappy wrote: Thirdly, when the point of no return is reached and a neck reset is the only alternative in (20-25 years ???) you can decide whether spending $250 - $350 (in 2009 dollars) is a worthwhile investment on the guitar. For a guitar in the $800 range that could be as high as 44% of the original cost. In that case the replacement cost of a new guitar would look attractive, as it would with any other tool that wore out over 20-25 years. If the original cost was very high, and the guitar held it's value well, then a reset makes more economic sense. I have no idea whether or not my neck angle on my PSD21 passes the test or not. Right now it plays great and I love the sound and the way it plays-- smooth and like butter. I played a Martin HD 28 the other day and I loved it---it reminded me of my PSD21. That said, I didn't think it sounded any better than my Stanford-- and I prefer the mahogany of the 21 sound and the Stanford played easier-- though that could be due to my 80/20 strings. So if it ever came to a neck reset for my Stanford, I would do it without hesitation-- for what I paid --- I'd still be way ahead of the game and the grand total would still be less than 1/2 the price of the Martin.
intune66		#13	[-]
Posts: 2270 (05/18/09 07:15 PM) Moderator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	poboxnyc wrote: Pappy wrote: Thirdly, when the point of no return is reached and a neck reset is the only alternative in (20-25 years ???) you can decide whether spending $250 - $350 (in 2009 dollars) is a worthwhile investment on the guitar. For a guitar in the $800 range that could be as high as 44% of the original cost. In that case the replacement cost of a new guitar would look attractive, as it would with any other tool that wore out over 20-25 years. If the original cost was very high, and the guitar held it's value well, then a reset makes more economic sense. I have no idea whether or not my neck angle on my PSD21 passes the test or not. Right now it plays great and I love the sound and the way it plays-- smooth and like butter. I played a Martin HD 28 the other day and I loved it---it reminded me of my PSD21. That said, I didn't think it sounded any better than my Stanford-- and I prefer the mahogany of the 21 sound and the Stanford played easier-- though that could be due to my 80/20 strings. So if it ever came to a neck reset for my Stanford, I would do it without hesitation-- for what I paid --- I'd still be way ahead of the game and the grand total would still be less than 1/2 the price of the Martin. I'm with you on that last thought especially....... What the heck could I replace any of them with for the cost of a reset? These guitars might be very hard to find by then too..... Ryan _____________________ Some of my Guitars: Stanford PSD-28, 21, 20 Blueridge BR-70, 60-AS Aria AD-80, R.K. RDC-57
Fstpicker		#14	[-]
Posts: 730 (05/18/09 07:41 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I'm sure my PSD-10 wouldn't pass either. I can pretty much tell by looking at it, from the first day I got it. However, the neck angle hasn't changed since I've got it in 1.5 yrs., so I'm not very worried about it. The action is still decent and the tone is...well, you know! Jeff
intune66		#15	[-]
Posts: 2272 (05/18/09 09:10 PM) Moderator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	rlouie wrote: my bet is that most of the performers series guitars will not pass the test.......................I'll be surprised if the PSD20 I am receiving tomorrow will pass the test........but rest assured yall will be the first to know..............but hell if I can get a good 10 years of playing out of her I've already won........................... Coincidentally my PSD-20 (the very first Stanford I ordered) is the 1 that passes the test, Louie. You might be surprised. In fact I was surprised because I was sure that my PSD-28 would pass with flying colors and it didn't. It has the most saddle of the 3 and doesn't appear to need any lowering. Plays awesome, but I don't generally worry about having super low action either. Of all my guitars the Alvarez has the lowest action but that seems to be the nature of Alvarez acoustics.....Low action and no buzz. Not sure how they do it, but it was like that right from the factory. Bet that guitar has a good neck angle. I should check it for sake of argument... Ryan _____________________ Some of my Guitars: Stanford PSD-28, 21, 20 Blueridge BR-70, 60-AS Aria AD-80, R.K. RDC-57
davis		#16	[-]
Posts: 83 (05/19/09 03:34 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I posted this on another thread and thought I prolly shoulda posted it here, but my PSD-21 didn't pass the straight edge test. It fell about 1/16" below the top of the bridge. I'm not gonna "fret" over it... it is what it is...
hat		#17	[-]
Posts: 18 (05/19/09 05:22 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	as a side note - if you have a guitar with a low neck angle and don't want to go to the expense of having the neck removed and re-set heres an option. By carefully removing the binding at the neck heel/back joint, you can slip a knife in and cut the back loose from the sides/neck. This will allow you to flex the neck backdown a little. Reglue the back, thim the little excess back material, and reglue the binding. A pretty easy procedure, certainly not for better quality instruments, but fine for the everyday axe you want to keep alive a few more years.
pugsleydorite.theunofficialma...		#18	[-]
Posts: 92 (05/19/09 08:55 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	hat wrote: as a side note - if you have a guitar with a low neck angle and don't want to go to the expense of having the neck removed and re-set heres an option. By carefully removing the binding at the neck heel/back joint, you can slip a knife in and cut the back loose from the sides/neck. This will allow you to flex the neck backdown a little. Reglue the back, thim the little excess back material, and reglue the binding. A pretty easy procedure, certainly not for better quality instruments, but fine for the everyday axe you want to keep alive a few more years. Oh the old "slipping the block" re-set method.
poboxnyc		#19	[-]
Posts: 39 (05/19/09 09:10 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	davis wrote: I posted this on another thread and thought I prolly shoulda posted it here, but my PSD-21 didn't pass the straight edge test. It fell about 1/16" below the top of the bridge. I'm not gonna "fret" over it... it is what it is... Tested my 3 guitars + my daughter's Ami Parlour: PSD21: 1/32-1/16 below top of bridge Blueridge 160: 1/16 over the top of the bridge Ami Parlour: 1/16 over the top of the bridge Stanford Furch OM20P: Absolutely perfect The Furch OM20P is a custom build and in my opinion as good as they get. I played a Collings OM and craftwise didn't feel it had anything on the Furch . Soundwise I prefered the Furch OM20P-- and definitely pricewise. My guess is anything other than a custom build will have reasonable tolerences and that even custom builds will have tolerence depending on the intentions of the builder?
intune66	Serious thoughts....	#20	[-]
Posts: 2276 (05/19/09 10:38 AM) Moderator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	While I know we've tended to downplay the low neck angle thing here, I actually have some serious thought to add to this. A member of another forum mentioned to me that he bought a used PSD-21 recently and really cant play it. He will never be able to lower the action to his liking (using the conventional method anyways) because of the issue. While I'm generally very mild mannered here I'm going to say that I'm actually disturbed about this whole thing, honestly. I didn't realize til very recently that this was sort of an epidemic with these Stanford Performers (and likely some other import name brands as well). I'm guessing that the percentages of current US bought Performers with low neck angles are pretty high. As I mentioned, 2 of my 3 have it and these were not sold as such. They play OK for me (medium to high action) but that doesn't mean that they will play OK for anyone who buys one with this problem. I hope that Stanford has cleared this up with any of their new models, if we happen to see any more of them in the US. Don't get me wrong. I'm just a little concerned now about recommending something that may have a problem that makes it unplayable for someone else . My minor rant for the day....... Ryan _____________________ Some of my Guitars: Stanford PSD-28, 21, 20 Blueridge BR-70, 60-AS Aria AD-80, R.K. RDC-57 Last Edited By: intune66 05/19/09 11:08 AM. Edited 3 times.

<< Previous Topic Next Topic >>

Yuku free message boards

Low Neck Angle-Stanford and other imports......

Low Neck Angle-Stanford and other imports......

Quick Reply